XXXIV. DISCUSSION, 
Mr. J. I. Haycrorr said that though every engineer did not or 
could not possess a testing machine, still he should be as far as 
possible conversant with the details of testing, as treated in the 
paper, in order to be in a position to write a sensible specification. 
At the outset, he might point out that the sequence, as set out in 
the paper, of the various bodies investigating this subject might 
be improved, as follows: the idea originated in 1884 at Munich 
as stated, the same technical convention meeting in subsequent 
years at Dresden, Berlin and Vienna. The American Society 
then took the matter up, and within the past two years a Com- 
mission of Research was authorised to make investigations in 
France. Not a single step in this forward movement had, as is 
usually the case in such matters, been taken in England, either 
by the Institution of Civil Engineers or other scientific bodies, 
though valuable individual research has occurred, and one could 
not look to the Board of Trade for any help in this matter. 
The investigations of the Commission of Research in France, 
were in his opinion, by far the most important of the several that 
have taken place, due both to the well known scientific character 
of the nation, the eminence of their professional men, and lastly, 
but most important fact, to their having analysed the proceedings 
of the former conventions held elsewhere. 
He wished to add to the paper some facts gathered from the 
French investigations, not in any way criticising the manner in 
which the paper has been compiled, or indeed in supplying what 
might be termed deficiencies, but with the object of making the 
members of the section acquainted with facts, and thereby adding, 
if possible, further value to the already valuable paper of the author. 
As regards dimensions of test pieces, the author stated that the 
American Society adopted for circular sections an area of test 
piece of 600 square millimeters for a useful length of 200 milli- 
meters, which gives a diameter of 27-64 millimeters. This mode 
of procedure should have been credited to the French Commission 
who, in order to make a comparison of the total elongations taken 
after rupture on circular test pieces of different design, decided to 
