497 
sible  for  them  to  be  offered  the  whole  of  the  land  for  refores- 
tation ? 
Mr.  Campbell.  I may  ask  Mr.  Hosmer,  as  expert  on  that  mat- 
ter, what  benefit  a portion  would  be  without  the  whole? 
Mr.  Hosmer.  In  reply  to  that  question,  I would  say  that  I 
should  much  prefer  to  see  the  thing  go  through  as  a whole,  be- 
cause I believe  the  value  of  reserving  this  whole  lot  of  forest 
would  be  much  greater  than  reserving  a portion  of  it.  But  I do 
think  the  Kehena  2nd  portion  is  probably  the  more  important  por- 
tion of  this  block,  for  the  reason  that  several  of  the  small  streams 
that  come  down  into  the  plantations,  some  of  which  go  into  the 
ditch,  and  some  others  which  ought  to  go  into  the  ditch — surplus 
water  at  any  rate — rise  on  this  land,  or  are  very  largely  influenced 
by  Kehena  2nd.  And  some  of  those  streams  don’t  go  up  as  far  as 
the  Kahua  lands.  For  that  reason  I think  the  Kehena  2nd  portion 
is  somewhat  more  important  than  the  Kahua  lands.  Every  effort 
ought,  however,  to  be  made  to  get  the  whole  block. 
Mr.  Campbell.  In  this  matter  the  Government  has  the  right  of 
eminent  domain ; it  could  condemn  those  lands.  Of  course  that 
proceeding  does  not  want  to  be  invoked  except  as  a very  last 
resort.  But,  however,  if  we  went  into  condemnation  proceedings 
for  this  forest  reserve,  we  would  have  to  be  backed  up  by  some- 
body to  guarantee  the  costs  and  payment  of  the  judgment  ren- 
dered by  the  court,  and  we  could  not  go  into  condemnation  pro- 
ceedings until  we  had  such  a guarantee.  I believe  there  are 
other  ways  to  settle  without  going  to  that  extreme.  Of  course, 
in  condemnation  proceedings  there  are  many  nice  features  that 
come  in.  It  is  a long,  slow  process,  and  it  might  take  years  to 
perfect,  or  get  a ruling  from  the  court,  or  a decision  in  the  matter. 
In  the  meantime  we  are  still  at  a standstill. 
Mr.  Holstein.  Wouldn’t  it  be  a good  thing  for  the  Kohala 
planters,  who  are  present  here  today,  as  well  as  those  who  act  as 
attorneys  and  agents,  to  come  together  this  afternoon  and  see 
what  they  will  offer  for  these  lands  ? I believe  this  is  the  sticking 
point  between  the  ranches  and  the  planters. 
Mr.  Watt.  I think  that  the  sticking  point  has  always  been  that 
the  Woods  Estate  has  always  refused  to  state  what  they  would 
ask  for  those  lands.  They  would  make  no  statement.  Our  last 
meeting,  I understood  Mr.  Holstein  was  going  to  write  to  ask 
them  to  state  a price.  Whether  he  has  done  it  or  not,  I don’t, 
know. 
Mr.  Holstein.  They  were  to  hold  a meeting.  The  idea  was 
that  the  Woods  Estate  was  to  come  together  sometime  in  Septem- 
ber and  state  to  us  how  much  they  wanted  for  these  lands.  If 
they  are  going  to  ask  too  large  a price  for  it  I don’t  think  that  the 
Kohala  planters  will  deem  it  advisable  to  have  anything  to  do  with 
it,  but  anything  within  the  limit,  I think  the  Kohala  planters  are 
willing  to  consider.  I would  like  to  hear  from  Mr.  John  Hind  on 
that  subject. 
