620 Bijhop Burnet’^ travels Book I L 
fpent at once in this Place, related to the Difpute on 
Foot between Mr. Schelftrat the Library-keeper and 
Mr. Maimbourg<i concerning the Council of Conjiance. 
The two Points in Debate, are the Words of the Decree 
made in the fourth Seffion,and the Pope’s Conrfimation. 
In the fourth SelTion, according to the French MafUi- 
icripts, a Decree was made, fubjecting the Pope, and 
all other Perfons whatfoever, to the Authority of the 
Cduncil, and to the Decrees it was to make, and to 
the Reformation it intended to ekablifli both in the 
Head and the Members *, which, as it implies that the 
Head was corrupted, and needed to be reformed, fo 
it fets the Council fo diredly above the Pope^ that this 
Sefllon, being confirmed by the Pope, puts thofe who 
aflert the Pope’s Infallibility to no fmall Straits : For if 
Pope Marlin^ that approved this Decree, was infallible, 
then this Decree is good flill ; and if he was not infal- 
lible, no other Pope was infallible. To all this Schel- 
firat anfwers from his Manufcripts, that the Words of 
a Reformation in Head and Members are not in the 
Decree of that Seffion ; and he did fhew me feveral 
Manufcripts, of which two were evidently writ during 
the Sitting of the Council, and were not at all dafh’d, 
in which thefe Words were not. I know the Hand 
and Way of Writing of that Age too well to be eafily 
niiftaken in my Judgment concerning thofe Manufcripts ; 
But if thofe Words are wanting, there are other Words 
in them that feem to be much ftronger for the Superi- 
ority of the Council above that Pope j for it is decreed, 
that Popes and all other Perfons were bound to fubmit 
to the Decifions of the Council, as to Faith ; which 
Words are not in the French Manufcripts 5 upon this I 
told Mr. Schelftrat, that I thought the Words in thefe 
Manufcripts were ftronger than the other, fince the 
Word Reformation, as it was ufed in the Time of that 
Council, belonged chiefly to the correding of Abufes, 
it being often applied to the Regulations that were made 
in the monaftick Orders, when they were brought to a 
more exad Obfervation of the Rules of their Order ; 
So though the Council had decreed a Reformation 
both of Head and Members, I do not fee that this 
would import more, than that the Papacy had fallen 
into fome Diforders that needed a Reformation j and 
this is not denied even by thofe who afifert the Pope’s 
Infallibility. But a Submiflion to Points of Faith, that 
is exprefty aflerted in the Roman Manufcripts, 
is a much more pofitive Evidence again ft the Pope’s 
Infallibility ; and the Word Faith is not capable of fo 
large a Senfe, as may be afcribed to Reformation. But 
this Difference in fo great a Point, between Manufcripts 
concerning fo late a Tranfadion, gave me Occafion to 
refted on the vaft Uncertainty of Tradition efpecially 
in Matters that are at a great Diftance from us; when 
thofe that were fo lately tranfaded, are fo differently 
reprefented in Manufcripts, and in which both thofe of 
Faris and Rome feem to carry all poflible Evidences of 
Sincerity. As for the Pope’s Confirmation of that 
Decree, it is true, by a general Bull Pope Martin con- 
firmed the Council of Condance to fuch a Period ; but 
befides that, he made a particular Bull, as SchelSirat af- 
fured me, in which he enumerated all the Decrees that 
he confirmed, and among thofe, this Decree concern- 
ing the Superiority of the Council is not named. This 
feemed to be of more Importance, and therefore I de- 
fired to fee the Original of the Bull, for there feem to 
be juft Reafons to apprehend a Forgery here : -He pro- 
mifed to do his Endeavour, though he told me that 
would not be eafy, for the Bulls were ftridly kept ; and 
the next Day when I came hoping to fee it, I could 
not be admitted ; but he affured me, that, if that had 
not been the laft Day of my Stay at Rome, he would 
have procured a Warrant for my feeing the Original : 
So this is all I can fay as to the Authenticity of that 
Bull. But fuppofing it to be genuine, I could not agree 
with Mr. Scheftrat, that the general Bull of Confirma- 
tion ought to be limited to the other that enumerates 
the particular Decrees : For fince that particular Bull 
was never difeovered till he found it out, it feems it was 
fecretly tnade, and did riot pafs according to the Forms 
©f ihe Confiftory, and was a fraudulent Thing, of 
which no Noile was to be made in that Age 5 and 
therefore in ail the Difpute that followed in the Council 
of Eafil, between the Pope and the Council upon this 
Point, no Mention was ever made of it by either Side 5 
and thus it can have no Force, unlefs it be to difeover 
the Artifices and Fraud of that Court: That at the 
fame Time in which the Neceflicy of their Affairs ob- 
liged the Pope to confirm the Decrees of the Council, 
he contrived a fecret Bull, which in another Age might 
be made ufe of to weaken the Authority of the general 
Confirmation that he gave *, and therefore a Bull that 
doth not pafs in due Form, and is not promulgated, 
is of no Authority, and fo this pretended Bull cannot 
lirnit the other Bull. 1 will not give you here a large 
Account of the learned Men at Rome ; Bellori is de- 
fervedly famous for his Knowledge of the Greek and 
Egyptian Antiquities, and for all that belongs to the 
Mythologies and Superftitions of the Heathens, and 
hath a Clofet richly furnilhed with fuch Things. Fa- 
hretti is juftly celebrated for his underftanding the old 
Roman Architefture and Fabricks. Padre Fahri is the 
chief Honour of the Jefuits College, and is much above 
the common Rate both for Philofophy, Mathematicks, 
and Church Hiftory. And he to whom I was the moft 
obliged. Abbot Nazari, hath fo general a View of the 
feveral Parts of Learning, though he has chiefly appli- 
ed himfelf to Philofophy and Mathematicks, and is a 
Man of fo engaging a Civility, and ufed me in fo par- 
ticular a Manner, that 1 owe him, as well as thofe 
others whom I have mentioned, and whom I had the 
Honour to fee, all the Acknowledgments of Efteem and 
Gratitude that I Can pofiibly make them. 
One fees in Cardinal Ejiree all the Advantages of a 
high Birth, great Parts, and a generous Civility, and a 
Meafure of Knowledge far above what can be expected 
from a Perfon of his Rank : But as he gave a noble 
Protedion to one of the moft learned Men that this 
Age hath produced, Mr. Launoy, who lived many Years 
with him, lb it is vifible, that he made a great Pro- 
grefs by the Converfation of fo extraordinary a Perfon ; 
and as for theological Learning, there is now none of the 
College equal to him. Cardinal Howard is too well 
known in England to need a Charader from me : The 
Elevation of his Condition hath not in the, leaft changed 
him 5 he hath all the Sweetnefs of Temper that we 
faw in him in England, and he retains the unaffeded 
Humility of a Friar, amidft all the Dignity of the Pur- 
ple, And as he fhews all the generous Concern for 
his Countrymen that they can exped from him, I met 
with fo much of it, in fo many obliging Marks of his 
Goodnefs, that went far beyond a common Civility, that 
I cannot enough acknowledge it. I was told, the Pope’s 
Confeffor was a very extraordinary Man for oriental 
Learning, which is but little known in Rome. He is 
a Mafter of the Arabick Tongue, and hath writ, as 
Abbot Nazari told me, the molt learned Book againft the 
Mahometan Religion, that the World hath yet feen, 
but is not yet printed : His Learning is not in Vqgue : 
and School Divinity, and cafuiftical Learning, being 
that for which Divines are moft efteemed, he whofe 
Studies lead him another Way is not fo much valued 
as he ought : and perhaps the fmall Account that the 
Pope makes of learned Men turns on him ; for it is cer- 
tain, that this is a Reign in which true Knowledge is very 
little encourag’d. Upon the general Contempt that all 
the Romans have for the prefent Pontificate, one made 
a pleafant Refledion to me. He faid, thofe Popes 
that intended to raife their Families, as they faw the 
Cenfure this brought upon them, ftudied to leffen it by 
other Things that might foften the Spirits of the Peo- 
ple. No Man did more for finiftiing St. PeteFs. and 
.the Library, and for furniftiing Rome with Water, than 
Pope Paul V. though at the fame time he did not for- 
get his Family. And though other Popes, that hfve 
raifed great Families, have not done this to fo eminent 
a Degree, yet there are many Remains of their Magni- 
ficence : whereas thofe Popes that have not raifed Fa- 
milies, have thought that alone was enough to main- 
tain their Reputation, and fo have not done much, 
either to recommend their Government to their Sub- 
