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the statement is a true one and fairly represents the authors’ meaning ? Hear 
what they say : — 
“Just as the fire” — in the Gehenna — “was always kept up, and the 
worm ever active in the one, so are we forced to contemplate an enduring 
process in the other. For we cannot easily agree with those who would 
limit the existence of evil to the present world. We know that the 
matter of the whole of the visible universe is of a piece with that which we 
recognize here, and the beings of other worlds must be subject to accidental 
occurrences from their relation with the outer universe, in the same way as 
we are. But if there be accident, must there not be pain and death ? Now, 
these are naturally associated in our minds with the presence of moral evil. 
We are thus drawn, if not absolutely forced, to surmise that the dark thread 
known as evil, is one which is very deeply woven into that garment of God 
which is called the universe. In fine, just as the arguments of this chapter 
lead us to regard the whole universe as eternal, .... and therefore we 
cannot easily imagine the universe without its Gehenna.” 
I have but summarized all this very briefly, using almost the very words, 
saying that “ Evil is woven into the essential texture of the garment with 
which the Eternal God, our Father, has clothed Himself.” 
Mr. MacColl. — There is however an essential difference. 
Dr. Irons. — I think not. I represent the actual meaning. I do not quote 
all the words, but I represent the meaning, and use the very words too. 
Mr. MacColl.— What I wanted to put before you was that, as I under- 
stand them, the authors assert that life began outside the Trinity through 
the operation of the Third Person in the Trinity. 
Dr. Irons. — Energy, not life, according to our authors. 
Mr. MacColl.— W hat I understand the passage to mean is that evil 
has existed since the creation of moral energy, and will probably exist 
always. 
Dr. Irons. — It is not for me to explain for our authors beyond saying 
that we are led by them to regard evil as eternal. 
Mr. MacColl— Eternal in the prospective. 
Dr. Irons.— No, in the past also. But I have a much more grave 
statement to make with regard to Mr. MacColl’s own position. He actually 
supposes the theological doctrine of the Logos endiathetos to mean in fact 
a conditioned being, whereas the Catholic doctrine is that the Logos which 
existed eternally with the Father as endiathetos, became prophorikos or put 
out from God, at the time of the Incarnation. 
Mr. MacColl. — Not at the time of the Incarnation. 
Dr. Irons. — I am stating what I believe to be the Catholic doctrine : you 
understand it to be something different. You think that the Logos 
endiathetos was the conditioned being. 
Mr. MacColl.— D r. Newman takes the view I have put forward. 
Dr. Irons. — Not that the Logos endiathetos is a conditioned being ? — 
We have travelled to-day more over the theological peculiarities than the 
scientific diffi culties, on which I had hoped some other persons would have 
